“Justice” For COVID, “DEI Population,” And is Fish an Herb?

The Independent Medical Alliance Annual Meeting and the Future of US Medicine

By Alex Morozov, Eviva Partners

April 6, 2025

ATLANTA, GA - The Independent Medical Alliance (IMA; Previously FLCCC) Annual Conference just wrapped up here in a small hotel in Atlanta’s ritzy Buckhead neighborhood. Epoch Times, a “pro-Trump Media Empire,” appeared to be the only media outlet present (I heard others were not allowed due to a “no press” policy). As a book writer, I was allowed to stay.

My one take-away is that this community can no longer be ignored, because it is becoming Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s go-to organization for policy questions. Dr Arthur Caplan, a medical ethicist at the New York University, said FLCCC committed “fraud during a pandemic on a significant scale.” “Profiting from bunk and nonsense has no place in ethical medicine,” he added. Now they are in Kennedy’s inner circle. Scary, but not a surprise given the other “experts” Kennedy recruited lately.

Another key take-away is that Trump and Kennedy are making a huge bet with our health – slowing research and treatment of disease, while pushing ahead with pseudoscientific wellness and prevention. See below for the answers I got when sharing this concern with Scott Atlas, Jeffrey Tucker (both were plenary speakers), David Mansdoerfer (Deputy Assistant Secretary of Health during Trump’s first term who now leads IMA Action), and Jay Richards, Director at the Heritage Foundation (a sponsor of the event) in charge of its brand-new MAHA-like Restoring America’s Wellness (RAW) initiative (more on this blending of Heritage and MAHA in another story).

My final take-away is that there is no visible opposition to these changes. I asked about the Brookings Institution (the liberal counterpart of Heritage), for example – everyone agreed they have been quiet. Atlas did offer an ominous warning, “This is not over – there is no disarming going on on the other side.” Maybe he knows something I don’t…

But my highlight of the weekend was Tucker’s plenary talk, in which he summarized his worldviews - anti-lockdown, pharma controls the world, etc - and then revealed the reason for HHS cuts in the form of a theatrical skit. “And this is why there is upheaval going on in Washington,” he said. “Nobody says it, but this is why.” “How come you just fired twenty thousand people from the HHS?” “Oh, cost cutting…” - he looks down, pretending to be a coy government spokesperson, then pauses to give the audience time to come to their own conclusion. “It’s not cost cutting. It’s JUSTICE. It’s JUSTICE.” (I later asked Tucker and Mansdoerfer whether this is the view of the White House as well - they said No).

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About 300-400 people were in attendance – young and old. I only saw three people of color (more on DEI later).

Medical providers were in the minority, maybe about 20-30%. Many attendees were there to learn “for themselves,” “for their grandkids,” or as amateur healers setting up group chats or spreading the word on how to take ivermectin and avoid vaccines. Lawyers walked about, looking for medical providers fired for refusing to get vaccinated, and discussing plans to sue state medical boards.

I met a retired pediatric oncologist who offers free consultations to adult cancer patients and prescribes ivermectin and other unproven therapies. Hearing of my science background, she peppered me with questions – “what do I think about the ivermectin + mebendazole combination for cancer?”

A psychologist in a major Northeast health network is against medical treatments. A doctor in the Veterans Affairs administration told me about massive group chats on Signal, a highly secure communication platform, where the whole ivermectin community congregates. There is one specifically for oncologists, she said. I asked, why Signal? And then answered my own question – they were in hiding during COVID. Now it’s the other way around – they are the “free thinkers,” the “independent medicine,” and mainstream doctors are moving to Signal.

Throughout the conference, speakers proudly announced how IMA is helping Kennedy.

First, they mobilized in January to help with his confirmation. Tim Clark, another member of IMA Action, said that they “carpet-bombed” Bill Cassidy’s district in Louisiana, calling thousands of constituents and transferring them directly to Cassidy’s phone lines, thus ensuring his tie-breaking committee vote. An opening video showed Senator Ron Johnson (a staunch MAHA supporter) holding a stack of “65 thousand letters” in support of Kennedy during the hearings – also the work of IMA Action, they said.

And when Kennedy recently needed to prep for a meeting to discuss bird flu, he called Dr Robert Mallone, an IMA Senior Advisor and one of the panelists at the event. Mallone was debunked in five separate Factcheck.org articles, yet still has a large following. IMA jumped into action and prepared a recommendation for Kennedy which he then executed successfully in the meeting.

The key player orchestrating all of this is David Mansdoerfer, whose role at IMA Action was not explained but everyone looked to him for policy questions. He served as Deputy Assistant Secretary of Health during Trump’s first term. Mansdoerfer was welcomed on stage and introduced as the holder of the prior record for firing the most HHS employees – this was under “Trump 1.0.” He said that from those days he is good friends with Heather Flick, Kennedy’s chief of staff, and many others. He has been to Atlanta twice before: once for his son’s soccer tournament, and once to fire the head of CDC in Trump’s first term, he said to thundering applause.

I asked Mansdoerfer whether IMA now has better access and understanding of HHS than the MAHA Alliance headed by Del Bigtree, and he agreed.

What’s next? Mansdoerfer spoke at length about the situation at HHS – “sausage-making in the swamp,” as he put it.

Normally at HHS there are 180-200 political appointees, but today there are only 30-40, he said. That’s where IMA can help, he said, bringing “intellectual capital.”

Top three priorities for HHS in the view of Mansdoerfer are, one, banning mRNA vaccines. He said it’s not a matter of if, but when – 3 months? 6 months? End of year? For now Kennedy “stalled” the Novovax mRNA vaccine that was finishing FDA review, and mRNA research at the NIH was stopped, David said. There is only one problem - Trump was the one overseeing Operation Warpspeed that rushed the vaccines out. Mansdoerfer said Kennedy is preparing for what is likely to be a “very difficult conversation at the White House.”

Two, Mansdoerfer said that Kennedy’s administration expects life expectancy to rise through MAHA policies, just like it did in the first Trump administration. Mirroring MAHA talking points, he talked of the “downward spiral” of health outcomes, alluding multiple times to reduced life expectancy in the US that he traced to the Affordable Care Act (even though ACA went into effect in 2014, just before Trump’s first term). Note that the National Center for Health Statistics, which produces life expectancy metrics, is part of the CDC.

(Speaking of the CDC, Mansdoerfer was asked about the interim-turned-permanent director, Susan Monarez. He said when he heard the news he reached out to several friends at HHS and they all came back to him and said “she is one of us.”)

And three, healthier food - there will be fewer ingredients on the back of your chicken nuggets, he said.

A question was asked about the future of public health. Mansdoerfer said that today it’s so corrupt that it needs to be “completely burned to the ground and rebuilt,” to thundering applause. What will be different? “Free thinking.” We will not be afraid to sound like racists or misogynists, he said. With the current public health system, resources are allocated from certain parts of the population to the “DE&I population.”

What a racist, ignorant thing to say, I thought. No wonder there are practically no people of color at this conference. I’ve never heard this said before - “DEI Population.” I emailed Mansdoerfer to clarify whether I heard him correctly, but he did not respond. [After this article was published, he responded and offered a clarification which confused me but seems to actually confirm my point: “I said that healthcare / public health was so focused on DE&I that it was neglecting being able to communicate with large portions of Americans. (Or something to that extent - I may have said population but that was unintended in reference to actual groups (more of a focus on the topic in general)”]

Mansdoerfer continued - we need to take back higher education. He asked for donors to fund fellowships so students can be trained on “diversity of thought.”

Mansdoerfer’s picture of success is a patient coming in with lower back pain and instead of being prescribed narcotics is given vitamins and told to exercise and cut out sugar. (Low back pain is “exceptionally difficult to treat,” a recent study showed).

I later asked Mansdoerfer about his vision for the new IMA-sponsored, “Free-thinking” medical school that he is in charge of planning. He told me he has prior experience with building medical schools (perhaps referring to his role as Advisor to the President of University of North Texas Health Science Center).

He described something similar to a traditional medical school, with a basic science component, offering both MD and MD-PhD degrees, but with an “independent” twist. When I asked to explain what this meant, he brought up ivermectin and the teachings of the IMA leaders, Marik and Varone (see P. S.). I asked whether he envisions them being leaders in the school, and he said “absolutely.” “How about in HHS,” I asked. He said he is not sure they can be successful being surrounded by people who disagree with them. “No kidding,” I thought.

What Does This All Mean for the Future of US Medicine? Jeffrey Tucker, Scott Atlas, David Mansdoerfer and Joe Richards (Heritage Foundation) weigh in.

I asked each of these folks a version of the same question. Do they share my concern with the risky bet the administration is making – gutting NIH and undermining the medical establishment that has been going from fundamental science to understanding of disease to the cycle of prevention, screening, treatment and survivorship, which is all very, very complicated as we know, and replacing that with populist slogans like “eat real food?” What if most disease cannot be prevented by MAHA strategies? And in the meantime we lost momentum on treatment and research?

Atlas said he is worried about the opposite – that Kennedy will not have a lasting impact, because the next administration will undo all his policies. He said “it doesn’t matter what Kennedy does – we just need a disruption.” In his plenary, he called for an “official statement of truth” the new administration needs to make with respect to COVID “mismanagement.” He claimed credit for opposing lockdowns along with John Ioannides months before the Great Barrington Declaration. “Lockdowns killed millions of people,” he said (a gross exaggeration even according to his fellow conservatives). And “Elon Musk is the most important freedom fighter in our lifetime.”

Mansdoerfer didn’t share my concern either, repeating Kennedy’s talking points – “our outcomes are worse, costs are rising.” I countered that in cancer, my field, outcomes are better. “One percentage point,” he asked, repeating a point made by someone else earlier in the meeting. “No – massive improvements,” I countered, giving him a quick overview of monumental advances in lung cancer, melanoma and others that he shockingly was not aware of. “OK, maybe not all outcomes are worse. But the obesity is epidemic is huge,” he said – another Kennedy point. “But being a devil’s advocate, what if we cannot overcome obesity without medication,” I asked. “The number one and probably the only proven ‘poison’ in our food is sugar, and I have not seen Kennedy make that a priority. Plus, we know that willing yourself into overcoming obesity is practically impossible due to irreversible changes in metabolism.” Mansdoerfer was not convinced. I didn't even mention GLP-1 agonists our science and medicine establishment produced. Trump’s administration just refused to reimburse these life-saving medicines that “may extend many lives by years, save billions in medical costs and divide public health into before-and-after epochs”.

Tucker was not concerned either. He is a believer in the “treatment causes disease” hypothesis which is a big part of the MAHA agenda. Not the first time he made unreasonable assumptions. His estranged daughter recalls that he did not believe in seatbelts and encouraged his teenage children to start smoking, telling them that “the dangers of lung cancer are vastly overplayed by the government,” she said. She finally was able to quit at age 28 after smoking for 15 years.

With Richards I was more upfront, similar to my conversation with Ed Fuelner. When I told him I am writing a book about evidence, he said he recently read a book about quackery. “Exactly,” I said. “Look at these guys here at IMA. Why is a reputable organization like The Heritage Foundation associating with them?” “We don’t discriminate,” he told me.

P.S. IMA’s history, mission and science

FLCCC was formed in March 2020 when “2 fringe doctors created the myth that ivermectin is a 'miracle cure' for COVID-19.” They were Pierre Kory and Paul Marik. It was a lucrative business. Pierre Kory subsequently left, as he announced recently, and was replaced by Joseph Varon.

The organization has a troubled history. Kory and Marik were both stripped of their Board certification by the American Board of Internal Medicine, and both are counter-suing the ABIM.

The rebranding to IMA in January reflects a major shift for the organization, said Jeff Hanson, a real-estate billionaire and IMA board member who touted his close ties to Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and his personal contribution to IMA “well into seven figures.”

IMA’s mission: “Building a Parallel Health System”

The overall mission of IMA is not clear from its website, but Jeffrey Tucker explained it in his plenary talk: “I asked about their mission, and they said, ‘Well, we are coming up with a Parallel Health System.’ That’s ambitious!”

With this mission, the 5 pillars Hansen described make a lot of sense:

1. A network of 47 “IMA Fellows” representing 35 specialties and 15 countries.

These international efforts appear to be led by Mallone. He said he spent time in Italy recently with a like-minded community there. I asked him which country he thinks will be next to adopt the MAHA movement. He said Italy, then Japan. However, he said, there is no leader like Kennedy anywhere in the world.

2. The Journal of Independent Medicine – see excellent profile by Important Context. The journal is the latest addition to a small but growing list of journals with a political “flavor”: pro-ivermectin (this journal), anti-lockdown (JAPH) and anti-vaccine (SPHPL).

3. IMA Action – the newly established sister organization with a lobbying focus, which appears to be headed by Mansdoerfer.

4. Creating a trusted physician network, using the Fellows as local champions. Hanson said that people are often asking him, “where can I find an awake physician?” (I understood this to mean someone who is open to using unproven therapies like ivermectin). This network is supposed to be the answer.

5. Establishing a “Free-thinking Medical School” to “recapture medical education and training.” This received thundering applause from the audience.

IMA’s science

There were no scientific presentations in the conference, only panel discussions which in my opinion as an oncologist and physician-scientist were shockingly pseudoscientific and often nonsensical. A few highlights are below – is this “gold standard science?” Judge for yourself.

Throughout the conference, references were made to IMA treatment protocols posted on its website that go back to FLCCC days “ to prevent and treat COVID-19, Long COVID, RSV, Flu and Vaccine-related issues”. Back in 2022, ABC quoted a Seattle ICU physician: "What concerns me is FLCCC presenting 'protocols' as proven treatments for long COVID. Throwing 20 medications (9 are prescription) at a problem with minimal (or no) evidence is irresponsible.”

More recently, cancer treatment protocols were added as well. The website includes a statement that (my highlight) “these protocols are based on an exploratory AI analysis… and the algorithms that AI uses are unclear.” A list of medications by tumor type is then provided. For example, for “prostate cancer,” 11 things are listed: Doxycycline (plus vitamin C), EGCG, Ivermectin, Sulforaphane, Curcumin, Metformin, Modified Citrus Pectin, Mebendazole, Resveratrol, Zinc, Quercetin.

A separate list is provided for other cancer types, with about 6-10 agents similar to those above. Even AML (acute myelogenous leukemia) that is normally only treated in highly specialized centers, has its own list and a recommendation, “in addition to standard chemotherapy the following compounds are suggested” – one of them is curcumin for which a warning is provided with some of the bullet points cutoff mid-sentence, and calling fish an herbal supplement.

Chris Jackman, a Nurse Practitioner at Carolina Holistic Medicine, said that even though oncologists often tell patients to stop supplements while getting systemic anticancer treatment, he and other “holistic” practitioners recommend the opposite – adding ivermectin, herbs, methylene blue, and increased doses of vitamins to “offset things done by the oncology team” and promote the patient’s “health and happiness.” This is obviously very dangerous as it could reduce efficacy of anticancer treatment, increase adverse events and overall compromise outcomes.

Logical errors were made left and right – not a surprise for this group. Varone cited a slide shown by Marik demonstrating a correlation between vitamin D levels and risk of cancer as evidence that vitamin D should help cancer patients – making a basic logical error of mixing up correlation and causation. Another panelist, a pediatrician, made a similar error when he suggested that fetal ultrasounds may be causing autism because of a known correlation. And after a long discussion about how mRNA vaccines integrate into host DNA and lead to life-long “shedding of spike,” a widely talked-about theory in this community, an audience question came in – “I never had the vaccine but had COVID three times. Could I still have spike?” Marik then admitted that there is no data on whether COVID infection itself could lead to spike expression, invalidating the entire prior discussion.

Nonetheless, several attendees told me they are self-medicating with these protocols. One elderly physician was recently diagnosed with prostate cancer and self-prescribed ivermectin and mebenzazole. He did not tell his oncologist - this appears to be a common approach. Several people are ordering ivermectin from India. If it gets confiscated at customs (importation of drugs from other countries without FDA clearance is obviously illegal), the Indian supplier offers free replacement. A pharmacist told me that patients often get their mainstream cancer treatment from an oncologist, and ivermectin from an “alternative” doctor. A Texas oncologist, Dr Ray Page, who participated in a panel, agreed, adding that interest in ivermectin is a new phenomenon.

One lady told me that after a career in sales, she turned to developing cancer treatments. She started a Whatsapp group which now has hundreds of members. When she learned that I am a cancer researcher, she shared her dilemma: she wants to add chlorine dioxide, promoted recently by Pierre Kory, to her proprietary mixture containing ivermectin, mebendazole and other components, one of which is an antioxidant. “I was thinking - should I combine an oxidant and an antioxidant,” she told me. “Let’s figure it out together.”